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E85 in supper C IH

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Alan Harmon

05-12-2008 19:35:40

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What ajustment has to be done to carb. to run E85 in my supper C. I pull with it in 3000 lb and 3500 lb class. Thanks Alan Harmon Wiggins CO.

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jd b puller

05-15-2008 20:43:07

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Re: E85 in supper C IH in reply to jlmtractor, 05-12-2008 19:35:40

garytomaszewski said: (quoted from post at 16:08:25 05/15/08) When they made real tractors they actually flared pipe connections and had few (READ NONE) o-rings. I've taken apart AC, IH, JD, MH, Wallis, Hart-Paar, MM, Aultman-Taylor, and assorted others from the pre-1960 era and found nary an o-ring seal or rubber fuel line anywhere. In your class they may even have told you that these old tractors were made to run on tractor fuel,etc. and to be careful because leaded gas would foul plugs. What school was this ? Do they have any published papers on E85 ? Did they teach you "bright headlights" how to spell ethAnol, or maybe they were right ethOnal is nasty?

Gary, what's the needle tip made of in the carb? I'm thinking it's usually rubber, but not Viton (which is resistant to ethanol)?

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Alan Harmon

05-13-2008 19:32:13

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Re: E85 in supper C IH in reply to Alan Harmon, 05-12-2008 19:35:40

Thanks for all the informason. You all gave some good ideas.See you at the next pull Bob

Alan

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ChadS

05-13-2008 05:16:17

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Re: E85 in supper C IH in reply to Alan Harmon, 05-12-2008 19:35:40

Your looking at rejetting the main circuit of the carburator. Drilling the main jet a few sizes larger. But first, you need to know how much cyl pressure your engine has to know how much E85 you can run. The higher cyl pressure the better, or more E85 you can run. If the Super C tests 150 psi, you can run safely a 75% gas- 25% E85 mix and see a difference. If it tests 170 and above, you can run a 50-50 mix,, up to 300 psi of cyl pressure. Currently, im setting up a H for pulling, and Ive ran it for a long time on E85,,, even left some in the tank to see what happens,,, it does spoil if not kept fresh,,, but it breaks down into an oily substance, like a thick corn oil residue. My cork seal in the sediment bowl was ok as long as it was running, but let it sit over time, it deteriorates, but its not a big deal, they need replaced every so often anyways. Hope this helps, ChadS

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Bob-Wyo

05-12-2008 20:24:06

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Re: E85 in supper C IH in reply to Alan Harmon, 05-12-2008 19:35:40

Paint it GREEN ALAN, LOL, hey E85 is what I was running at Ft Luton in the ole D, did pretty good huh? I really think you have to have the compression up pretty good for it to work good.
I had idle screw openn1/2 turn more and Load screw opened up 2 & 3 turns. About this rubber thing I don't know, 2 many opions, like one said how come HEET dont' eat the rubber?
Getting any snow down that way or do you have spring and we get the snow evey 3 days? LOL.
Bob

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onefarmer

05-12-2008 20:21:49

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Re: E85 in supper C IH in reply to Alan Harmon, 05-12-2008 19:35:40

You will need to richen up the mixture a bit. I used E85 in my Farmall M all last summer with no trouble at all. This summer I will be using it in my JD620 also. I ran it in my non-flexfuel Ford F150. The computer couldn't richen the fuel enough with 100% E85 but did very good on a 50/50 mix.

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Frank A

05-12-2008 19:59:12

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Re: E85 in supper C IH in reply to Alan Harmon, 05-12-2008 19:35:40

I don't know alot about your tractor but E85 will eat on rubber "O"rings and gas lines. If the gas tank has been cleaned recently or E10 is being used good, if not it will desolve alot of junk so be prepared to change filters.

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onefarmer

05-12-2008 20:27:42

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Re: E85 in supper C IH in reply to Frank A, 05-12-2008 19:59:12

Is this first hand experiance? Or are you repeating what you hear?

I'd like to hear from people with first hand on this. I can see it dissolving gum and plugging the first few filters. But I don't see it compromising orings or fuel lines unless they were ready to go anyway.

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Leland

05-13-2008 20:39:22

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Re: E85 in supper C IH in reply to onefarmer, 05-12-2008 20:27:42

Saw many a car in a local shop where E 85 played he!! on the fuel system and it will eat up rubber fuel lines .

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Frank A

05-13-2008 19:50:53

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Re: E85 in supper C IH in reply to onefarmer, 05-12-2008 20:27:42

I guess you could say it's what I hear. I am a manager of a propane plant for a oil company based in Missouri that has been promoting home grown fuel. The sales and delagate meetings comprise of propane and bulk fuel plants so try or not I hear alot of information that I don't need but might be helpfull to someone else You can go to E85fuel.com click on about E85 and read the frequently asks questions and see that flex. fuel vehicles have special fuel lines and evan gas tanks for that matter.

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RAB

05-12-2008 23:12:13

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Re: E85 in supper C IH in reply to onefarmer, 05-12-2008 20:27:42

Ethanol is an aliphatic organic compound. Dino fuel used to be nearly all aromatic. Differences between these types of compounds is basically the benzene ring (aromatics) and straight, or branched chain (aliphatics). Aliphatics will often mix with/dissolve in water and aromatics mostly not.

That also means they dissolve different solids to different degrees. The old rings and pipes were made in materials of the day which were resistant to the fuels of the day. That is now not the case when using bio fuels. Hence the possible problems.

Note I said possible. The older the machine parts the more probable parts may be attacked/degraded. Warnings come in 'cover yourself against any litigation' these days.

One of the differences is that ethanol will hold water in the fuel and so may cause more corrosion of mild steel. Others are plastic tanks for dino may be slowly attacked by bio, energy density is different (so fuel metering may be compromised), volatility and combustion rates are different. Etc etc.

Maybe all small things but any one of them might be just too much in any individual situation.

Regards, RAB

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garytomaszewski

05-12-2008 20:20:04

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Re: E85 in supper C IH in reply to Frank A, 05-12-2008 19:59:12

Why must the first comment about E85 always be it will eat out your whatever? E10 has been around for 20+years and many of the oil companies were using much harsher "detergents" all along. I burn E85 in F20, F12, SC, DC, 800, A, B. All 50+ years old, NO HOLES in gas tanks,gas lines, carbs. The man is going to pull his C so I will guess he did not just pull it out of the weeds and wants to put fuel in it and pull.

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dhermesc

05-13-2008 05:56:52

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Re: E85 in supper C IH in reply to garytomaszewski, 05-12-2008 20:20:04

"Why must the first comment about E85 always be it will eat out your whatever? E10 has been around for 20+years and many of the oil companies were using much harsher "detergents" all along."

Agreed. I've been running E10 (and more) in my 1968 F600 since 1984 and have put well over 150K on it since then - still waiting for the carb and fuel line to be "eaten away".

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garytomaszewski

05-12-2008 20:24:21

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Re: E85 in supper C IH in reply to garytomaszewski, 05-12-2008 20:20:04

Dang I forgot, this month is the INDY 500. Perhaps you've heard the 220+ mph autos are running on 100% ETHANOL. Maybe they should worry about their fuel systems!!!

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Frank A

05-14-2008 13:12:35

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Re: E85 in supper C IH in reply to garytomaszewski, 05-12-2008 20:24:21

Someones headlights would have to bee burning kinda dim to compare a car engineered to run on ethanol and an old farm tractor made for regular gas. The college I got my degree in ag mech. & diesel tech has been working with E85 vehicles since the mid 80s, its clean burning and produces a little less heat but I remember the instructor giving me an O ring and saying if it will hold up with ethonal it will hold up with about anything.It doesn't figure to tell someome to make all these changes on their fuel system to run E85 and not tell them the simple things to upgrade

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garytomaszewski

05-15-2008 12:08:25

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Re: E85 in supper C IH in reply to Frank A, 05-14-2008 13:12:35

When they made real tractors they actually flared pipe connections and had few (READ NONE) o-rings. I've taken apart AC, IH, JD, MH, Wallis, Hart-Paar, MM, Aultman-Taylor, and assorted others from the pre-1960 era and found nary an o-ring seal or rubber fuel line anywhere. In your class they may even have told you that these old tractors were made to run on tractor fuel,etc. and to be careful because leaded gas would foul plugs. What school was this ? Do they have any published papers on E85 ? Did they teach you "bright headlights" how to spell ethAnol, or maybe they were right ethOnal is nasty?

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Frank A

05-15-2008 20:33:06

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Re: E85 in supper C IH in reply to garytomaszewski, 05-15-2008 12:08:25

If you read my first comment I said I didn't know about his tractor, but I have seen people use rubber fuel line for one reason or another. I don't know about the school I went to publishing any papers I just know they were involved in the ethanol challenge for many years.I also know what the company I work for says and anyone can look on E85fuel.com and see. I probably shouldn't have been insulting[ at least until I know you better] but your smart reply to a comment that directet to you wasn't needed. By the way I already know my 11 year old daughter can spell better than I.

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Gerald J.

05-12-2008 19:45:52

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Re: E85 in supper C IH in reply to Alan Harmon, 05-12-2008 19:35:40

Open up the main jet. To get performance raise the compression ratio a lot.

Gerald J.

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