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Re: fuel mileage

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Ryan - WI

12-26-2007 05:47:27




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I have a horse in this race so my input is admittedly biased.

In 2003 my wife and I bought the diesel version of VW's new Beetle. It has a 1.9 liter turbocharged diesel tied to a 5 speed transmission. The car is identical to any other US Beetle with the exception of the drivetrain. The safety tests are the same. We regularly see 45+ mpg and shortly after we got it (with 16000 miles) we averaged 51 on a vacation to Door County WI. As far as I understand it the diesels put out less harmful exhausts although they are smellier. The environmental gas emissions which are harmful are clear and odorless so it seems like the diesel exhasut is worse but it isn't.
Volkswagen has offered a diesel line of their cars and vans for forever with the exception of recently with the change to US ULSD fuels and requirements. The diesel is being revived in future years however.

My biggest take on why there are not more fuel efficient vehicles in the US is the main thing which makes our economy run. If there is no demand, there will be no supply. People pay a lot of lip service to wanting better mileage but that often takes a back seat to other things like going fast and looking cool. As fuel prices increase and people get ticked off there is a greater demand for diesel vehicles. Our 2001 with 130,000 still has a blue book value of between $6000 - $7000 while a similar gas is valued around $4000. That is why you saw Chrysler offer diesel engines.

I think diesel will be making more of a comeback but I would not count on it happening tomorrow. Most people regardless of what they say don't really want a diesel, they just say they do.

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Larry59

12-26-2007 06:21:32




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 Re: fuel mileage in reply to Ryan - WI, 12-26-2007 05:47:27  
I don't understand why diesel is so much higher here then gas? Did not seem to be that way a few years ago. Yet the talk of cars will get 35 mph in the near future the Goverment says! Yet I have a 1999 Ford Escort that was bought new. I got 38 to 39 miles a gallon for years. Now getting still 33 to 35 at 170,000. My dad had a 1954 full size Cad. in 1959 that got 18 to 21 on the road and was a far better built car back then then those now. Just hard to understand why so much trouble these days on miles per gallon? As for the diesel engine. Takes less time to produce the diesel over gas yet, it cost more. However I do think Diesel will and is making a comeback in some areas. Thanks

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IH2444

12-26-2007 06:49:12




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 Re: fuel mileage in reply to Larry59, 12-26-2007 06:21:32  
Fuel prices now seemed linked to BTU content of the fuel.
Diesel has more BTU's than Gasoline, so a higher price.



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Mathias NY

12-26-2007 10:15:29




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 Re: fuel mileage in reply to IH2444, 12-26-2007 06:49:12  
Supply versus demand and production capabilites play a significant role here too.

As it was explained to me, diesel fuel is a byproduct of the refining process. So there is a maximum and a minimum amount of diesel produced for each barral of crude that is refined. There is some flexibility to that ratio, but it is not as variable as gasoline.

A good portion of homes heat with fuel oil, aka diesel fuel. The price for this explodes in the fall and winter months because the damand does too. In the spring and summer months where demand is lower, production is relatively unchanged and the price will drop.

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Larry59

12-26-2007 16:55:46




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 Re: fuel mileage in reply to Mathias NY, 12-26-2007 10:15:29  
Interesting.. fuel oil is diesel.. hummm I never knew that. Makes sense! Thanks



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NEsota

12-26-2007 06:15:56




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 Re: fuel mileage in reply to Ryan - WI, 12-26-2007 05:47:27  
During my short stay in France a few years ago it seemed like the majority of the passenger cars were small and diesel powered. Their fuel taxes are much higher there than in the U.S. Maybe higher fuel taxes in the U.S. would increase the percentage of diesels, also get us better roads and bridges.



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MN Scott

12-26-2007 06:55:46




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 Re: fuel mileage in reply to NEsota, 12-26-2007 06:15:56  
I wouldn't bet on the increased taxs equaling better roads. The poltcians would just suck the money off for their pet progects. Here in MN a lot of our fuel taxes are spent on public transportation progects for the twin citys area on progects that no one uses like light rail.



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Walt Davies

12-26-2007 08:15:00




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 Re: fuel mileage in reply to MN Scott, 12-26-2007 06:55:46  
The biggest trouble with light rail is it goes from no-where to no-where. It all started in SF, CA where they built it to take people from across the bay to downtown SF, that was a good idea and it worked because its hard to get to downtown SF and there isn't anyplace to park when you get there.
Now take the one in Portland, OR its worthless because it goes from no-where to no-where and most people don't even pay to ride it, because its all run on a "Hey we trust you to be honest and pay" system.
Now we have a multi-million dollar Aerial Tram that goes from downtown to the the top of the hill where the Hospital is. Why would a sick person drive all the way downtown to ride back up the hill he just came down to get to where was already and on top of that pay $4.50 per person.
Doesn't make any sense.

Walt

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MN Scott

12-26-2007 09:53:38




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 Re: fuel mileage in reply to Walt Davies, 12-26-2007 08:15:00  
Not much seems to make sense when the goverment is involved!



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