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Tractor Talk Discussion Forum

Welding tractor rims w/tire on

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steveinct

10-14-2003 05:23:56




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Hi everyone, I have an Allis B that is missing one of the lugs on the inside of the rim that keep the wheel in place. I can fabricate a new lug easy enough, but the tires are fluid filled, and no one close handles draining and refilling them. So can I, if I'm careful and I go slow, weld on the lug with the tire mounted on the rim?? All feedback is appreciated. Thanks!




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T.J.-N.J.

10-16-2003 15:45:39




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 Re: Welding tractor rims w/tire on in reply to steveinct, 10-14-2003 05:23:56  
If it is an Allis rim the clamps bolt on not weld on. T.J.



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RJ-AZ

10-15-2003 20:14:41




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 Re: Welding tractor rims w/tire on in reply to steveinct, 10-14-2003 05:23:56  
We have an old boy here in the valley who talks with a slur and can't remember his wifes name half the time. He also has a big dent in his fender (forehead) that matches the contour of the swather wheel he was welding on.



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JMS/MN

10-15-2003 11:17:18




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 Re: Welding tractor rims w/tire on in reply to steveinct, 10-14-2003 05:23:56  
I haven't read all of the other comments but the simple answer is - do not do it.. If the rim has a tube in it, the heat of welding, no matter how slow, will put a hole in the tube= flat tire, and you have to take it apart like you should have done it in the first place- fluid in or not.



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Dieselrider

10-14-2003 18:14:05




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 Re: Welding tractor rims w/tire on in reply to steveinct, 10-14-2003 05:23:56  
Ok, you would make the stupid hall of fame if you try something like this. However you can remove the fluid yourself and take the tire off yourself. You do not need a pump. Put the tire up where you can siphon the fluid into a barrel or two. Even by pulling the tractor up on a barn bridge or something. Or take it to a tire repair shop after the tire is drained so they can remove it for you.



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I REPEAT, DON'T DO IT!!

10-14-2003 14:28:52




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 Re: Welding tractor rims w/tire on in reply to steveinct, 10-14-2003 05:23:56  
There are still people responding with suggestions on how to, what rod to use, on and on. THIS IS A VERY BAD IDEA!!! It dosen't matter if Fix-A-Flat has been used or not. The oxygen in the air in the tube combines with the rubber vapors (yes rubber innertubes give off a vapor) and can create a perfect explosive mixture. All it needs is a ignition source to set it off. Large aircraft inflate their tires with nitrogen to remove this hazard from passenger aircraft tires.
I think that this is kind of like looking down the barrel of a gun & pulling the trigger to see if it is loaded. If you are lucky, it won't go off. If not, then all your family & friends will get together and say nice things about you.
If you insist, please add me to your life insurance policy. Take my word for it, the risk is not worth it.

Britt Misker

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Old Peddler

10-14-2003 13:13:23




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 Re: Welding tractor rims w/tire on in reply to steveinct, 10-14-2003 05:23:56  
"So can I, if I'm careful and I go slow, weld on the lug with the tire mounted on the rim?? All feedback is appreciated. Thanks!"

Before I give my opinion, answer these two questions?

1. How much Insurance money will your wife get if you die an accidental death while working on your tractor?

2. Is she pretty?

Just Kidding! NO, Do not attempt to weld on that rim with the tire still mounted. For all reasons not to do it listed below.

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HaySam

10-14-2003 10:08:55




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 Re: Welding tractor rims w/tire on in reply to steveinct, 10-14-2003 05:23:56  
Another good reason to use wheel weights I hate a LOADED tire!



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kyhayman

10-14-2003 09:29:54




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 Re: Welding tractor rims w/tire on in reply to steveinct, 10-14-2003 05:23:56  
You are getting a lot of 'no's' and a lot of reasons why. First of all, I won't weld a rim with a mounted tire unless it is filled with fluid. If it just has air in it it could have fix a flat (bad news)too (bad news).

It's still not a good idea (I guess, always here of people killed blowing up tires but the only ones I have ever personally seen in the news were either with fix a flat or split rims). If you decide to do it anyway here is my personal take on it: A lot depends on your skill, if you burn through the rim you have ruined the tube. I normally weld 1" bead, immediately flush with water, clean and move on. Like a E6011 at about 90 amps or a E6010 DC electrode negative.

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markct

10-14-2003 10:08:33




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 Re: Re: Welding tractor rims w/tire on in reply to kyhayman, 10-14-2003 09:29:54  
even if he doesnt burn thru the rim his tube will melt just from the heat, steel melts at over 2000 degrees, so its that hot where the weld is, even on the backside of the weld it would still be plenty hot enough to melt the rubber inner tube. and about the tire being filled with liquid, liquid will heat up, and can overpressurize the tire then blow it up, and the mess could include a steam explosion since its basicly like a boiler. bottom line is dont do it no matter what

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kyhayman

10-14-2003 18:52:48




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 Re: Re: Re: Welding tractor rims w/tire on in reply to markct, 10-14-2003 10:08:33  
Markct,

The next one I do may very well detonate but over the last 15 years I have welded over 100 rear tractor rims with fluid in them. Properly done the the tube does not melt. The water does not boil, and the tire does not explode. The water acts as a heat sink, just like a pan on a stove with water in it doesn't melt until the water all boils away. I broke down a set of rears of my own last week to put new tires on, both rims have been welded and there is not a spot on either tube. Not wanting to get into an argument but it isn't all that much heat. An example, today I was welding a belt guide for a round baler. The guides were white hot yet not 2 inches away you could pick up the steel bare handed. 5 minutes later the same spot was too hot to touch. It takes a finite anount of time for heat to travel and if you remove the heat (with running water before it has time to get into do damage it is ok.

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RMarg

10-14-2003 07:36:29




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 Re: Welding tractor rims w/tire on in reply to steveinct, 10-14-2003 05:23:56  
buy a drill pump and a 55 gallion drum drain the tire and dismount it do your welding and put it back on and then refill it you can buy an adpator at the parts house to hook up the drill pump its slow but it does work and you can save some monet also



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Britt Misker

10-14-2003 07:10:37




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 Re: Welding tractor rims w/tire on in reply to steveinct, 10-14-2003 05:23:56  
NO NO NO!!!!! !!!!1
IN ADDITION TO ALL THE ABOVE, THE TIRE CAN EXPLODE. THERE HAVE BEEN SEVERAL PEOPLE KILLED TRYING TO SAVE A FEW DOLLARS DOING JUST WHAT YOU DESCRIBE. THE ATMOSPHERE INSIDE A TIRE WILL EXPLODE IF SUBJECTED TO THE RIGHT IGNITION SOURCE. DON'T TAKE A CHANCE. YOUR LIFE IS NOT WORTH IT. AND TO ALL YOU PEOPLE THAT HAVE DONE IT AND GOTTEN AWAY WITH IT,,,,, JUST THANK GOD THAT IT WASN'T YOUR TURN TO GO.
SPEND A FEW BUCKS AND GET IT DONE RIGHT. YOUR LOVED ONES WILL THANK YOU FOR IT.

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brian Bullard`

10-14-2003 20:01:52




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 Re: Re: Welding tractor rims w/tire on in reply to Britt Misker, 10-14-2003 07:10:37  
this is a test



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markct

10-14-2003 06:57:42




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 Re: Welding tractor rims w/tire on in reply to steveinct, 10-14-2003 05:23:56  
if it was a tubeless tire and not filled with liquid i would say you could probably get away with it if ya took out the valve core, but on a filled tire i would never try it, not to mention the fact that the inner tube would melt so then ya will have to break down the tire anyhow. its not that hard to drain the tires anyhow, my father has drained them before with one of those little pumps that you power off a drill, worked pretty good, and he put it back in the same way. definatly do not try and weld it the way it is tho.

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paul

10-14-2003 06:46:36




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 Re: Welding tractor rims w/tire on in reply to steveinct, 10-14-2003 05:23:56  
No.

--->Paul



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rhudson no no

10-14-2003 06:27:33




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 Re: Welding tractor rims w/tire on in reply to steveinct, 10-14-2003 05:23:56  
that could get you killed also. you would be welding on a pressure vessel. the steam could blow the tire off, and into you. with other tires, there are cases of the tire being filled with flatfix that exploded from welding.



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Well........No

10-14-2003 05:42:14




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 Re: Welding tractor rims w/tire on in reply to steveinct, 10-14-2003 05:23:56  
Inner tube will melt.



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