Fuels, fuels and more fuels - questions?

Hi All,

So we used to have fuel pumps on-site at the farm, diesel and regular but no more.

I do have several good condition tanks - above ground with feet as well as in ground.

The tractors use diesel, non-ethanol premium and the house uses dyed diesel, cars use regulas, boats - non-ethanol.

So, with prices still low, am trying to figure out a way to buy everything now to get me through next spring/summer.

House tank is only 200 gallons, typically burn 700 gallons a winter (-20° not unheard of).

Can y'all help me think of a way to hook up a system to where I can get all the diesel I need for the house and tractors?

If I put a standing tank outside by the fill for the house, come winter it will gel terribly unless I use additives - also that location isn't good for filling tractors.

If I put above-ground by barn, works great for tractors but exposed in winter, still needs additives and moving smaller amounts to the house seems a pain.

If put additional 500 gallon tank in basement, no worry about gelling, but couldn't use for tractors.

Maybe multiple tanks? Add another 500 gallon to basement for house and put above ground 500 for tractors? And another 500 gallon for non-ethanol?

If do that route, do the above ground need anything special to sit, full or near full for almost a year?

Goal is to fill up now and not have to fill up again until next spring/summer.

Also have several 200 gallon tanks, 100 tanks gallon, 50 gallon drums, 250 and 500 gallon tanks etc.

Lastly - how pump in basement or outside if not using gravity and what line filters recommend for use in winter if outdoors?

Thanks!

You might want to read the link.

If you read it with a open mind rather than trying to find a loop hole such as I am not from Michigan so that does not apply to me you might learn something.

I say this because it happens every time I post such rules. Some one always says my fuel supplier said we did not need to do this.
Farm fuel tanks

You need 700 gallons for the house and you currently have a 200 gallon tank in the basement. So, you need another 500 gallons in the basement for household use. Assuming you can figure out a way to get a 500 gallon tank into the basement, why don't you just do that and consider that dedicated fuel for the house? Then, store diesel and gas for tractors, cars outside. I am in Wisconsin where -20F is normal in winter. I store my diesel fuel in above ground tanks outside and buy premium diesel fuel. Use Goldenrod water block fuel filters attached to the pumps on the tanks. Also have a 110 gallon portable diesel tank to chase after stuff in the field. When tanks go empty I clean them out completely before refilling. Use old diesel fuel from tank bottoms to burn stumps. I never treat the fuel in the outside storage tanks and have no problem with fuel gelling in winter due to the tractor fuel filters being mounted close enough to the engine to keep them hot. The one exception is the combine which has a fuel filter down on the bottom of the tank 10 feet away from the engine. That fuel gets winter treatment as does the fuel in the 110 gallon portable as that's what I use to fill the combine. Although I do use the portable tank for most winter fueling because it's handier and it does get the winter treatment.You seem to have plenty of tanks? Am I wrong? I buy my tanks new from Highland Tank in Pennsylvania. Best tanks, UL rated, best prices. Look out for local fuel dealers. They'll try to charge 4 times what the price should be. I buy my fuel from a big Cooperatve. Best prices plus I get a dividend for anything I buy from or sell to them.

John, it’s actually really good to review something like that and plan some.

My township has a 1/4 acre lot they put a maintenance building up, road grater and snow plow, as well as a gathering room for meetings, voting, etc not sure what it’s capacity would be. They have a 500 gallon diesel fuel barrel sitting 2 feet outside the building wall. Little awning over the tank. Across the driveway maybe 60 feet is the old creamery, with the big deep well that is now the water supply for most of the village of 50 people. Across the state highway the other way is a wetland with cattails, it probably is several 100 feet tho so should be ok.

I often wonder if they followed the rules we have to follow with all that.

Again, not doing the argument you don’t want, just it’s interesting who does and doesn’t comply with stuff.

I don’t think they like fuel barrels in the basement any more, especially if you have a floor drain in the basement?

Reviewing and planing for all the fuel, manure, water, septic, and so forth items one needs on a place is a really good thing, using a chart like that. I might not agree with every detail in place, and it appears even the govt doesn’t always agree either, but it sure is good planning.

Paul

Paul there are lots of regulations with little enforcement. That is until you have a spill and contaminate a river or your neighbors well. Then the fines get into the big bucks.

One reason I don’t like talking about this subject. Every one thinks I’m crazy when I try to tell them the rules because they have never seen anyone follow them so what I’m saying can’t be true.

Thanks for the replies.

Looks like some calls are in order if, after reading the pdf, I go that route.

Should be easy to comply will all the regulations, but definitely not something to be taken lightly.

Looks like this will be a "down the road project" should this farming idea work out and have a need for on-site fueling.

I can just imagine the fuel savings now 😀 nice to have a goal 😆

700 Gallons of fuel oil a winter is a big expense to heat a house. Have you looked into adding some more insulation to the house or switching to an alternate fuel like LP gas and a high efficiency furnace to reduce heating costs? If natural gas is available it is usually lower cost than LPG.

The resale price of a farm houses that is not on a paved road is usually very low. Now-a-day many younger farmers choose to live in town and commute to the farm rather than upgrade or replace an old farm house. This is especially true when good homes are low cost in depressed small rural towns.

Buy an old fuel truck problem solved.

Dad has fuel oil furnaces in the buildings and the tanks sit outside year round. Uses the same fuel as the tractors do. IIRC it is premium with an anti gel additive from supplier.
This is in northern ohio.

Fuel prices have already nearly returned to pre-pandemic prices. I don't see a big savings from stockpiling fuel at today's prices. Do you anticipate something big on the horizon that could cause fuel prices to spike during this recession, or are you simply trying to reduce the number of deliveries to reduce your delivery fees?

Wow, around you prices are already back to pre-2020 levels?

Round here still under $2.00 a gallon.

John, They are true. And most farmers in MI that have on farm fuel either have tanks like we have that are above ground so can see if it leaks, and the in ground tanks. We don't have any in ground and don't worry about them. The problem I see is the old tanks are thicker and weld able if needed. The new ones are so thin it doesn't take much to make them leak.

Now as for Champagne's problem why not just use a portable pump and tank for the refueling of tractors to pump fuel into the house tank this would remove the large quantity of fuel in the cellar/basement of the house for any fumes from the fuel and then you can set your fuel tanks in a row for easy filling of tractors. This allows you to use whatever tanks you want where it is handy. Though the tax is different for house fuel versus farm fuel in the diesel fuel in MI. A tank in a pickup or on a trailer can be used to move the fuel.

Heres how I do it. I have several 275 gallon tanks that I welded up skids onto that I can move around easily with my forklift. Additionally I have two stationary tanks in the house basement for the furnace & water heater. Also one stationary in the barn for the heater and to fuel the tractors.
When prices are down and I want fuel I set however many tanks outside and the fuel guy fills them. I then move them into the barn or to wherever I need to fill one of the stationary tanks and pump it into them.
Maybe this wont work in some locations but its how I have done it for over 25 years with no complaints so far. I have everything I own full right now.

I don't have a dog in the hunt but I have seen plastic wading pools with farm tanks set in them. Of course the tank skids are set in the pool, not through the pool since a hole in the plastic would defeat the purpose.