Just Plain Stumped!

Allan in NE · Sep 20, 2011

I dunno guys,

Been turning wrenches since I was a brat and can only remember one bad head gasket.

Tore that Hydro 70 (301 gasser) apart yesterday and the head gasket was burnt clear thru in one place and just about thru in two other spots.

Four years ago, I had the head planned and took a straight edge to the block. Could not find a warp.

What in the heck is causing this thing to eat head gaskets? This one makes the third in 5 years.

Allan

Anonymous-0 · Sep 20, 2011

sounds like the dodge stratus we had :roll: I order copper spray for several folks here (say they can't get it here). They swear by it because I guess it's not real easy or affordable to take a head to the machine shop. Not being a mechanic that goes that deep, I can't confirm or deny but they say t takes care of small inperfections and keeps them from burning out. (???)

Dave

tomNE · Sep 20, 2011

just had a perkins in a massey do the same thing.
dealer said we prepped the gasket wrong.
replaced it the way they said and torgued the bolts a little different. so far it's holding.
good luck!

Allan in NE · Sep 20, 2011

The darned thing has a bad pipe coming out of the exhaust manifold and rainwater will get into the manifold.

After it rains, it will hydro lock while cranking until the rainwater clears. I've been just "bumping" the starter to clear the water.

Ya don't suppose that's what is causing this headgasket problem?

It was running just fine. That night we had another rain. Next morning had to go thru this "clear the water" operation before starting and that's when it started to miss.

Ya don't suppose?

Allan

Allan in NE · Sep 20, 2011

Put this one together last time with Copper Coat. I've also tried aluminum paint, which is about the same thing.

Allan

Anonymous-0 · Sep 20, 2011

(quoted from post at 06:42:06 09/20/11) The darned thing has a bad pipe coming out of the exhaust manifold and rainwater will get into the manifold.

After it rains, it will hydro lock while cranking until the rainwater clears. I've been just "bumping" the starter to clear the water.

Ya don't suppose that's what is causing this headgasket problem?

It was running just fine. That night we had another rain. Next morning had to go thru this "clear the water" operation before starting and that's when it started to miss.

Ya don't suppose?

Had a jeep engine shot because of water leaking in from a bad headgasket and not getting back out the same leak hole before the piston busted.....

Allan

25twin · Sep 20, 2011

Allan,
Water doesn't compress. When you "bump" it through it's damaging the gasket. Fix the exhaust pipe and you will cure the gasket problem.

rhouston · Sep 20, 2011

I agree. At the least remove a spark plug to clear the water until the manifold can be repaired.

Allan in NE · Sep 20, 2011

Yeah,

This last time it happened, I remember thinking, "I just bent a valve". :>(

I'll just bet that is what is going on here. Engines just don't eat head gaskets like that.

On the cylinders where the gasket isn't totally blown, the compression ring(s) (of the gasket) is bent in towards the cylinder.

Allan

Anonymous-0 · Sep 20, 2011

(quoted from post at 06:55:41 09/20/11) I agree. At the least remove a spark plug to clear the water until the manifold can be repaired.

Shot a jeep engine because a headgasket seeped water in overnight and the piston went before the water forced back out...

Anonymous-0 · Sep 20, 2011

Allan,,, Your just using The WRONG Head Gaskets.

Allan in NE · Sep 20, 2011

Last one was a Felpro. Bad choice?

Allan

Anonymous-0 · Sep 20, 2011

(quoted from post at 07:11:59 09/20/11) Last one was a Felpro. Bad choice?

Allan

joey's just jabbering.....

Anonymous-0 · Sep 20, 2011

That Joey sure gets to you Dave2
you should try being his friend.

Anonymous-0 · Sep 20, 2011

(quoted from post at 07:26:56 09/20/11) That Joey sure gets to you Dave2
you should try being his friend.

Did but he always manages to make an a$$ of himself. How bout if he behaves himself (to everybody) and we try again????

Russ from MN · Sep 20, 2011

The water getting in is probably the problem, keep it inside! In all the WW2 movies they show the flyboys turning the propellers over by hand on the big radials to clear the accumulated oil from the bottom cylinders. I understand this could bend rods as well as blow gaskets.

the tractor vet · Sep 20, 2011

Allen if you are getting them from the parts store you are getting a WILL FIT. I have run into this many years ago on a C263 and a Fel Pro set. after the third gasket in as many weeks on a DECKED block and a Fresh Ground head with the CORRECT finish it would not seal and do just what you are seeing. I even went as far as getting on the phone with Fel Pro tech dept. and like you have twisted wrenches since i was 15 . The young computed snot was trying to tell me i did not know how to torque a head down . SOOOOooo i went to Case I H and bought a OEM gskt and it also was a FEL PRo BUT it was not made the same as the parts store one . I installed it and OH GUESS WHAT it sealed and i have had no problems with it since . Now one other thing did you chase the threads in the block and chase the head bolts ??? lube them with a LITTLE white grease and then take them down in three steps BUT you have to go to 105-110 on the torque not the 95 . And retorque after she has run for about a half hour .

Ray · Sep 20, 2011

I had that trouble witth a 450 case dozer till i went to case and got the correct gasket.That's been 5 years ago now.

jm. · Sep 20, 2011

My best guess is you have figured it out. That water just has a way of being hard on the gasket.. I have used copper coat on high performance engines for years and swear by it on head gaskets. Glad to have you back posting.

Tony in Mass. · Sep 20, 2011

This is from the MF 3165 highway mower I bought for scrap value. A poster child for hydro-lock wouldn't you say? And- because it was shot, no one covered the vertical exhaust at all anymore, so all were siezed. And this is the rare parts gas Perkins, what a trip this is. I never liked vertical exhaust, always a rain cap check at night, and a white pale if a storm coming. Water and engines just don't mix. Concider yourself luck if rain drops wrecked a few head gaskets, insted of this kinda mess...

JBMac · Sep 20, 2011

Alot of the 100 series Masseys had a drain hole at the bottom of the manifold, I keep that hole cleaned. Not that this really relevant, but could the same be done on other tractors?

chess · Sep 20, 2011

Allen ,I wont get into head gasket advise but all Case tractors i kave been around since 41 sc to 30 series had drain holes in exaust manifolds.Forgot if 70 series did?? Just make sure yours does .Make sure cylinder height is with in specks.Good luck

Old Roy · Sep 20, 2011

That's OK Dave .Shirley left him out of the cage again.

pete 23 · Sep 20, 2011

I have a souvenir wrist pin from a 1086 that sat out in real rain storm. When they went to start it, all heck came loose. When we tore it down we found the wrist pin snapped right in two pieces. Those are husky pins in those engines too.

JDseller · Sep 20, 2011

First!!!! Get an OEM gasket. I have had too many problems with after market gaskets on tractors that last 5-10 years. I may use after market sleaves and pistons but an OEM gasket set.

Second!!!!! Fix the exhaust leak and install a rain cap. You are lucky that you have not bent a valve or connecting rod. If you can't do that then remove the spark plugs and spin it over. Even invest in a empty five gallon bucket and tarp strap to cover the leaking exhaust. What has it cost you to replace the head gaskets several times???

You seem like a level headed guy but bumping water through your tractor motor is not a smart move. Your are lucky that you have not caused major damage to your motor.

RodinNS · Sep 20, 2011

I dunno... but any engines I've seen that had liquids on top of a piston came out with bent rods. Mabey you should call yourself lucky that the gasket gave up?
I really don't know if that is the source of the problem tho.
Think I'd try the OEM gasket this time and run a bottoming tap down every hole.
I did have one Ford 201 here that fought for a couple of gaskets... and that was a likely combination of me not chasing the holes down (trying to get done quick) and the head hanging up on one of the dowels... ever so slightly. Knock on wood... it's been tight for 2 years now.

Rod

Allan in NE · Sep 21, 2011

Pretty sure the rainwater is coming in around the threads on that exhaust pipe, because every couple of months I've gotta take a pipe wrench to it because it has "walked".

'Spose I ought to find my plumbing friend and have him make me a new pipe. Fairly good sized pipe; 3 inches maybe?

Yeah, its got a rain cap.

Allan

Just Plain Stumped!

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