1956 Fordson Major Hard-Starting when Cold

lsaami

Member
Hello fellow Fordson owners! I am the proud owner of a nice '56 Major Diesel for light farm duties here in NW Minnesota. I've had this tractor for about a year now, and the previous owner had a lot of work done to it, including injection pump and injectors rebuilt, wiring, starter, alternator and gauges replaced, new tires, paint, etc. It's been a great tractor for me, aside from once last season when the timing slipped on the pump coupler and I had to re-adjust it.

One thing i've noticed, that doesn't seem to be normal about it is that it is pretty reluctant to start, especially if it's under 60 degrees F. this morning, it was about 35F and it took a good 20+ seconds on the starter to get it to fire (even with the cold start button pressed), and it bucked and belched white smoke for a solid 5 minutes before clearing up. From working on other diesel engine. Since owning, I have run fuel system cleaner through it and tried both retarding and advancing the pump timing on the coupler with little to no effect.

Once warmed up, it runs great and seems to have good power. it ran the 3 point tiller with ease, and the temp gauge mostly stays just over 100.

Hoping someone can steer me in the right direction here as winter is approaching quickly, and I hope to put the old girl to use this winter.
 
Welcome to the board. You must have a problem as Major's, even in the coldest weather, fire up before you press the lever, or at least it seems like that.

If you have had a faulty drive coupling, did you line the marks up with the fly wheel at the correct degree setting because it seems like your timing is retarded, what with the white smoke?


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If you have the Mk1 engine with no breather on the timing cover it should be set at 26 degrees, Mk2 engine with breather on the timing cover is 23 degrees.

If the engine has no window in the sump under the R/H side channel, then your tractor is an early one and not a 1956. In this case you will have a notch on the front pulley and a pointer attached to the dynamo bracket.

Two engine identifiers, 1. Does the throttle rod go through the block or around the back of the block? 2. How many screws hold the rocker cover on? Early engines have two bolts through the top of the cover, later engines have six screws around the lip of the cover.
 
Thanks for the reply Majorman! Looks like I do have a late model, as I have 6 rocker cover screws, and the governer linkage goes behind the block.

When the timing slipped last year, I just mean that the claw bolts in the couple came loose, and I had to adjust/tighten them.

Ill locate that cover and double check the hard timing today, and report back.
 
So, after some investigation, with the Timing mark lined up on the Injection Pump, and the first rotation it showed about 15 degrees. rotated 180 and it's showing 23 degrees.I took photos of the timing marks




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That looks a bit strange as you were on Number 1 cylinder, both times, by the position of the coupling clamp bolt. Timing marks should only line up every second rotation as the pump drive turns at half engine speed. There are Woodruff keys in the pump drive shaft and in the timing gear that have been known to shear and also three bolts holding the camshaft gear onto the camshaft but usually you would not get the tractor to start at all if that happened.

A worn engine would also give you those sorts of starting problems and so would a head gasket blown between two cylinders. Bit difficult to diagnose from so far away so just best guessing. Oil leaks and blowby would indicate a worn engine so I would think a head gasket is the most likely answer.
 
Interesting. What is normal as for blowby? Seems like a head gasket would get worse, or a be a problem on a warm engine, whereas a worn engine might get better once up to operating temp. I did switch from the sae 30 oil the previous owner had in there to 15w-40, and that had no measurable impact.

It also doesnt seem to have any oil or coolant in the exhaust. Just a lot of raw diesel.

I guess a compression test is in order? Whats the best way to test these engines? Pull the injectors?
 
I looked back on the paperwork I got from the previous owner, and it looks like they did a head gasket with the injectors/ injection pump rebuild.
 
I would not be using 15/40W in that tractor, I use 20/50W in mine and all my petrol and diesel tractors. I found I got many oil leaks when using 15/40W that all disappeared, and my oil pressure improved when I changed. But it is your tractor and your choice.

Might be an idea to check the valve clearance before going too far, setting is 0.015 inlet and 0.012 exhaust if fitted with rotator caps and 0.015 if no rotator caps.

There will always be some blow by on an engine that old, but it should not be excessive, just a bit of misting when you take the filler cap off. Any white scum under the filler cap indicates leaking head gasket.

You will need to remove the injectors and use a special adaptor with a high-pressure gauge to check the compression.
 
Sounds good, I double checked timing and now with all rotations it shows 23 degrees. Man is it ever touchy on getting that injection pump timing mark lined up. Theres 15+ degrees of slop in the coupler!

I checked coolant level, and I dont see any in the filler neck. I know for a fact I topped it off this spring I also checked the blowby. Very little coming out the breather hose. If I take the filler cap off and put my hand over it, I feel slight pressure, but nothing crazy. No visible mist, at least when cold.
 
I should note, I plan to use this to plow snow in the winter, and it gets down to -30F regularly here.

With the 15w-40 I see 40 PSI of oil pressure cold, and hot idle it will be at 20. Hot load runs about 30.
 
Where is the movement in the coupler? If it is on the engine side, it means the key and possibly the keyway on the drive shaft is damaged. If it is movement in the shaft itself, then it is the keyway in the timing gear or the three bolts in the camshaft gear.

If it is the fibre drive, new ones are available. There should be no movement in the drive to the pump, even 1 degree out will change the engine performance.

You need to investigate further, pull the pump off and check that driveline. Could be someone has not put the drive key back and is just relying on the clamp bolt.
 
The play is in the fiber coupler. The engine side to the shaft is tight, as is the injection pump side. Linked below is a video I took. Apologies for the shake as it's hard to turn the fan and video at the same time.
Video
 
Does not look like 10 degrees of movement in that coupler but it is hard to judge from over here ;0). First thing is to get a new fibre drive, they make them of nylon now.

Do not know if this site stocks them but Agriline does and will ship to the US. Their part number is 5644. The original was E1ADDN993184. Case New Holland may also have them. English price is 15.00 pounds inc. tax but may have risen slightly. Certainly it is the first thing to change and will not break the bank.

They were a wearing item back in the day but not seen one put the timing that far out before.
 
I have been setting on the sidelines just watching, because Majorman gives good advice. Personally; I would slide the pump back and remove the coupler, just to make sure there isn't a sheared or partially sheared key, or sloppy keyway. I have seen them with a tight clamp bolt, that you can't move by hand, but the torque and resistance of the engine and pump will move them on the shaft. Looking at your pictures, it seems the slot clamp bolts are too far to the right, from where I remember them to be at correct timing, As a quick reference we used to use the thickness of an American dime at the left side of the slot(if my old mind remembers correctly). That's in reference to the slot being at the top of rotation. Correct me if I'm off base Majorman. I know of no other way for the timing to slip, unless it were to jump (break) a tooth on the timing gear.
 
If you do an internet search for Fordson Major injection pump drive coupling, there are several suppliers, various material.
 
Thanks for the input! agreed, Majorman is a real wealth of information. I have used his advice many times before posting here.

I ordered a nylon coupling coming from Canada, as that's a bit closer to me than the UK. ETA is mid next week. I rewatched my video and realized it doesn't quite do it justice. We shall see what happens when i get the replacement pad, and pull it all apart.
 
You are spot on Skipper, I, too, can see no way for the timing to move on that engine other than keys or loose bolts on the camshaft gear. They were a bit of a problem on some tractor back in the day, hence the move to a single bolt fixing camshaft when valve spring tension increased. Tooth breakage on any of the gears would be a very rare occurrence though I have seen it happen once, found it when I stripped the engine down but that one still ran OK except for a timing cover seal leak.

Brian
 
for future readers, Case New Holland dealerships do have the part listed online, at least. Same part number as OEM ford.
 
Also: not sure if it matters, but I realized this is a 1957, not a '56. It has the two-stage clutch for live hydraulics and PTO.
 
No, the engine was basically the same from 1952 to 1964, with ongoing changes to head and other components. You have what is known as the Modified engine or Mk 2, with the timing cover breather, inclined injection pump and a little more power.
 

Well I got the nylon coupling in the mail today, and installed it right after work.

it runs much better. Because of the air in the injection lines, it's hard to judge the cold starting. It used to have a noticeable miss at a slow idle that is gone. It idles smooth as butter even all the way down to minimum throttle. It fired up much better when warm too, barely turning the engine, where before it would take 3-4 cylinders to fire to get going.

I'll test cold starting tomorrow and reply back.
 
Still didn't want to start today. Not very cold either - about 47F. I rechecked timing and it seems to be at about 21 degrees. Tomorrow I'll get it right at 23 and try again.

When i had the pump off yesterday I confirmed the coupler on the pump end was solid, and the coupler on the engine side had a small amount of lash in the teeth, but nothing that would make me concerned.
 

Adjusted the timing, again. It was around 20 degrees. set to 23, and it starts better. still not like some of the ones online, but it idles smoother and seems to be much happier in general.

I still have some slack in the coupler between the nylon pad and the steel fingers. not sure what the factory spec is.

in the meantime, i noticed that my axle fluid is overfull, and my transmission fluid is low. Is there a seal between the two that can go bad?
 
There should not be any slack in there at all but a bit of wear after all these years
is acceptable. The half on the drive shaft side should be pushed firmly onto the drive
pad. They are not a silent drive and there will always be s clatter, that is normal.

There are two seals in the back end, a double one in the PTO housing and the seal
behind the large gear where the gearbox joins the pinion shaft. My Major also leaks.
The way I work mine is to have a pipe that I fit on my trailer tipping pipe, and I
transfer oil back into the gearbox filler. Been doing that for the past 20 years, not
really a problem and I do not want to do s double split to sort it. It is a pretty
common problem.
 

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