Trenching

A wind storm pulled the electrical service wire out of the brick of the house this past winter. The lag bolts have done this so many times that the brick face is badly damaged at the attachment area. So it's time to get that wire underground. While I'm at it, I'm running a 60 amp service to my shop. I used the '58 961D and the '47 2N to dig the trench down about 12". Code here is 24", so I dug the remainder by hand. I have another 80' or so to finish. The wide front on the 2N ended up being the best set-up for this job.

Colin, MN

And the trench - about 40 feet from shop to corner of the house.

You won't regret running it underground.
Run it in over-sized conduit, with a spare set of wires.
Run a phone line and internet cable out there with it too.
Even if you don't need them now, you might want them later.
You might consider over-sizing the service too.
Just in case you add a welder/compressor/etc later.
Just my two cents from retrofitting my stuff in the past.

Those are all good ideas. Thank you, Royse! I am going to run phone, but I'm thinking a wifi booster might be less expensive than running Cat5. Do you think 2" conduit is big enough? I have a welder and I run a 20gal compressor. I am mulling over 100amp service...just don't know yet what the total bill is going to be. Unfortunately, I also need a new pole at the property boundary, so that'll be spendy.

Colin

200 ft of cat 5 is less than $10 and none of the weather or metal
RF interference related issues that you might have with wireless.
Two inch might do it, depending on the size of your service wire.
Money is tight all over, but think about the cost (and labor) of
digging it up and doing it over.

I just did mine and ran a bundle of 3 #4 Aluminum direct burial in 1&1/4" conduit - it was tough to pull but cheaper than the copper. I'd go with 2" conduit next time. I didn't pull any extra wires for wifi and found that the steel siding of the barn is like stepping into a cone of silence for wifi and radio reception!

60 amp service will leave you wanting for more. When I wired my barn, I ran copper #4 (IIRC) for 100 amp and I sure wish I had run bigger wire. My welder can take up to 50 amps, and the lights will take 1 - 2 amps per bulb. If your air compressor turns on while the welder is being used then you blow the main breaker. The 225 Lincoln buzz box draws a max of 37 amps, so that may work with a 60 amp shop. However future electrical needs are always bigger than your today's estimate. Cat 5 wire is very cheap per foot so I'd recommend that as well. Maybe the compromise is to run smaller wires through a 1" gray plastic conduit (so that you can pull them or add later if necessary) and leave the separate power wires in the bare ground. They are allowed to carry more amps if not in a conduit because the heat being generated by current flow is not trapped within the conduit, but is more easily dissipated if they are separate from each other. But I do not profess to know the current code, so you may want to check with your county electrical inspector for his advice. When I put in a recent burried electrical line I also put a stout but thin nylon cord into the conduit to make pulling an additional control or security wire easily done in the future. The bigger the radius is on the turns, the easier it is to pull wires through it. Instead of using the manufactured conduit 90* turns, I just used a heat gun on a straight section and made very gentle turns.

Glad that enough frost is gone that you can dig now.

Best wishes!

Paul in MN

I have a 125 amp service to a shop I built in 1973. I have run a 5hp single phase compressor and also a 225 amp welder at the same time with no problem. The lights may flicker when the compressor cuts in, but that is the only indication of voltage drop.

I suggest running a small conduit about a foot away from the electrical wiring to carry your communication/data wiring in order to avoid radio frequency interference from the power wires. Any separation of the two is better than putting them in one conduit.

Nice looking dirt...I concur with the folks that say run an oversized conduit. it's not tat much more $.

pete

Thank you all for the good thoughts and ideas. I finished digging on the east and north side of the house. I also dug in a line for phone/data into the main line. MP&L came by this morning and we determined the location of the new pole (old pole is going to serve the remainder of its life as fence corner posts). Found out that the cost of the pole is not covered by me, but by the utility, which was welcome news!

Based on your advice, I'm going to consider doing the 100 amp service and will definitely do phone/data in a separate conduit.

Thanks again!
Colin

Hey Colin check code I was told you cannot run all that in the same conduit and I know it's not good to run cat5 with power just my FYI

Looking at having to do some of that this year too. Glad I have a backhoe 8)

Rick

The power company covers them here too, but you
never know about other states and their codes, etc.
Heck, around here it varies county to county.
Sometimes just across the road!
I'm glad that worked out in your favor!

I had to trench between my house and garage for power and dropped a compressed air line in there too. The compressor is in the garage and there's a coupler in the basement of the house. I'm remodeling so it's nice to be able to run a nail gun in the house without having to hear the compressor run.

You know, the N did a really good job. I was really pleased. 12 to 14" depth once I figured out a rhythm. The last 12" took time, but river bottom loam and sand. Black dirt 24" down.

Colin

I lucked out. The line foreman had to come and check. Had the pole been closer to the house, it is my impression from the regional manager that I would have had to pay.

Also, purchased 100' of Cat6 cable for $24 today. Holy buckets! Last time I purchased ethernet cable (admittedly this was a decade ago) I paid $1.25/ft. Thanks for the friendly prod in the right direction

Colin

That's very cool about the air hose!

Colin

Paul, Found a pocket of frost on the north side of the shop. The rain took most of it out.

Looks like I'll move the meter to the pole and I think it actually makes most sense to run a separate conduit for the house (200amps) and one for the shop (100amps). They'll share the same trench for about 50' or 60'.

Hope you're enjoying the sunshine and warm-up!
Colin